00:00:00: Here we are at Lucarno to talk about Frank and Louise, the new film by Swiss director Petra Volpe with one of two main actors.

00:00:07: Actually it's Rob Morgan.

00:00:09: you're both here now!

00:00:10: Hi!

00:00:11: So first

00:00:11: how are ya doing?

00:00:12: Bless in lovely Lacarno.

00:00:16: We're great very excited about Monday.

00:00:18: Yeah then there is a big screening at Piazza Grande.

00:00:21: that always an amazing feeling.

00:00:23: You already had your premiere at Sundance.

00:00:26: so How many festivals did you do?

00:00:29: European premiere, so this is our second festival.

00:00:32: After Sundance we waited to have a really good platform for our European premiere.

00:00:36: Locarna's the perfect place!

00:00:38: Petra it's your English language debut?

00:00:40: The film you made after the Berlinale success late shift or as German title was held in.

00:00:47: what was your motivation ?

00:00:48: Was there plan do and film an english language and work in England US I think It

00:00:53: came with project.

00:00:54: You know been working on this project for ten years.

00:00:58: My co-author Esther Bernstorff came across the story of these men who take care of kind of incarcerated man, younger incarcerated men.

00:01:06: Who would take care all their incarcerated men with Alzheimer's and dementia?

00:01:10: And we started to work on a script in two thousand fourteen.

00:01:12: I went for first time into prison in San Luis Obispo To actually talk about goldcoats there.

00:01:17: That was my kickoff For this project These conversations and encounters.

00:01:22: So it comes from topic With setting.

00:01:25: It wasn't set out intentionally make an English language movie, but it came with a subject.

00:01:31: But now I've lived in the US also for eleven years so It felt quite natural and organic to work in English.

00:01:36: Well

00:01:37: when did you come on board?

00:01:38: And Did You know about these projects taking place In prisons?

00:01:43: No wasn't familiar With it by casting director that i admire alot AV Kaufman.

00:01:48: She reached out and shared The script.

00:01:50: once I read it was completely Ready To get involved Be On Board.

00:02:02: And what did it mean for you, like especially at this time?

00:02:06: It seems that all the police violence in the

00:02:08: U.S.,

00:02:08: it seem to get always worse and then I think they cannot get more worse than gets still worst.

00:02:12: so many people are unjustly also incarcerated.

00:02:15: there's a lot of discussion.

00:02:17: if somebody who is mentally not anymore able to understand their crime especially since the prison, as we see has not necessarily been means to properly care for them.

00:02:31: How did it feel you take part in this project and what does that have a political meaning?

00:02:36: Well I mean... It's meant a lot because exactly what just described is America The unjust system.

00:02:42: I think stories like these will bring more compassion And help people actually understand they are treating unjustly and hopefully make some changes You know In culture..in society Because everything you describe is ingrained in the American culture, American society.

00:02:58: So art is a way of healing and art it's showing people you know different ways so that they can share some compassion for others who don't look like them or are not like them exactly.

00:03:09: And I felt this film was great stepping stone to moving into their direction.

00:03:13: Petra how what research process did

00:03:17: you do?

00:03:18: In my director photography I went first time to San Luis Obispo California Men's Colony And I conducted very long interviews with the goldcoats and really tried to understand their work, where they were coming from.

00:03:31: Their personalities, their histories... Then we worked on a script then went back into prison with the screenplay and read it in a goldcoat.

00:03:39: They gave us feedback on that script.

00:03:41: They were involved commenting about it telling whether things are depicted in an authentic way.

00:03:47: It was pretty immersive and supported also by the prison psychologist Dr Steed You know, helping us getting all the permissions to get into prison.

00:03:57: Before we were shooting We had consultants for Rob and Kingsley also of ex goldcoats who live in California Who are still connected And they read the script and Rob and Kingsey Were able talk with them and ask questions.

00:04:10: There was a podcast that is really important For us.

00:04:13: It's called Ear Hustle.

00:04:15: Erlon Woods and Nigel Poor Are two podcasters who did a podcast for incarcerated people who talked about their lives In San Quentin.

00:04:23: that was a very important kind of source for us, or in the sources just to understand the place more deeper than their prison is.

00:04:30: So there were lots different kinds elements and research which went into this movie.

00:04:35: The

00:04:35: question goes both you what's your biggest challenge when building these characters?

00:04:41: I

00:04:42: think the whole thing from me...I'm completely out my comfort zone as director, writer with a lot humility also responsibility of trying to really, really represent something or really get it across what we wanted to say with this story.

00:04:59: So the whole project was for me a huge challenge and especially because I had such a sense of like wanting to get it right and do something that touches people and makes them feel and see some thing from aside that they don't normally look at it give them perspective on people incarcerated people.

00:05:18: That is really different And For Me It's A Very Feminist film about men, like I wanted to show in a place that's usually seen as the place of toxic masculinity where there is lot violence when you see also it depicted on media.

00:05:31: It's usually gangs and its violence.

00:05:33: but what i experienced with my conversations with these man was so much compassion ,so much love .

00:05:40: So much tenderness And this man have all those things too and thats really important for me.

00:05:50: challenging or I think it was more about wanting to represent these people in the most honest way, you know?

00:05:56: Because what we do essentially is give voice to The Voiceless.

00:06:20: Did you have on the development of your character whether some unique things that You felt important to bring to this person?

00:06:27: That were not necessarily there in the beginning?

00:06:29: well when I first agreed Well, we first found out then.

00:06:32: We're gonna go onboard did do The project.

00:06:34: I reached out to the Alzheimer's Association of New Bern North Carolina.

00:06:38: They put me in touch with two couples that was actually experiencing a story that would tell it But they weren't incarcerated.

00:06:44: You know he was too.

00:06:45: couples never been incarcerated.

00:06:47: There are very affluent so they had all all the resources that they needed to deal with it, the disease.

00:06:52: They were still able to lend me the nuances of what this disease does to a person who is human especially at a young age.

00:06:59: Alzheimer's ideally or onset Alzheimer's idealy.

00:07:02: people think you know seventy and older.

00:07:04: but I met with uh... The man was struggling with this at fifty three years old.

00:07:08: You Know What I mean?

00:07:09: And another couple i've met where he was fifty seven.

00:07:11: so ya'know just shows how this disease doesn't separate anybody.

00:07:15: But yet we can potentially struggle.

00:07:31: That's something interesting where I like to pick up with both of you an element of empathy, because as he just said we all struggle from the same disease.

00:07:39: We see people that are incarcerated or maybe might not have committed a crime more than ourselves.

00:07:46: instead separate society or separate that we have nothing to do with them because they have the same fragility, the same physical ailments.

00:07:54: They also get dementia...they have bad sleep and all the things that we struggle with outside

00:08:00: As much as we'd like to separate ourselves from the prison population.

00:08:04: The prison population is just a mere reflection of who are.

00:08:08: We don't see our selves only in people who were ill and had Alzheimer's and dementia.

00:08:16: compassion and caring, I think whenever i talk about this project people are very astonished that murderers can take care of other people.

00:08:25: but if you give the chance to be a mens or human being then they can.

00:08:31: People have infinite ability too change.

00:08:34: also often these men are defined by one thing in their lives The one horrible thing we don't want minimize.

00:08:41: But not only that They're full human beings with capacity for compassion for changing, for tenderness and all of that.

00:08:49: That was also really important to us And I think for me it's a universal topic in this subject.

00:08:54: It is like the humanity.

00:08:55: we wanted to find the humanity In these places and people who are very often dehumanized by society but also media.

00:09:03: Did

00:09:03: you shoot an actual prison?

00:09:05: We shot at old prisons so we didn't shoot in a working prison But we shot in the UK in an old Victorian prison.

00:09:13: Would you talk about it a little bit?

00:09:15: They are planned to shoot also in a working prison.

00:09:17: Would that never have been possible?

00:09:19: For

00:09:19: many reasons, I didn't want to do that.

00:09:21: I think there's always an element of voyeurism when you then sell the movie with The Argument or it is like A Real Prison With Real inmates and i don't really Like idea Of That because people Have a Certain Reaction To The Realness Of Prison!

00:09:39: And

00:09:41: Also It Was An Indie Project Film.

00:09:43: So The Budget You know, didn't allow for things like that.

00:09:46: That cost a lot of money to shoot in the real prison with real prisoners you know?

00:09:49: A lot of security and lots of money.

00:09:51: so this is an indie project.

00:09:53: we put our hearts & souls into.

00:09:54: We look forward to the world actually taking it in.

00:09:58: I was also wondering how did you develop all these little scenes between people Like with Alzheimer's For example when they're waiting In the prison yard?

00:10:05: there are those kind of tragic but almost absurdly comic scene When their'e waiting for a bus thats never gonna come.

00:10:11: How do deal with all these moments?

00:10:13: Are these like actual experiences from people's dementia?

00:10:17: So you

00:10:17: saw them.

00:10:18: Yeah,

00:10:18: yeah I did!

00:10:18: I saw it at Sundance.

00:10:19: actually

00:10:21: You know the research wasn't only the prison research.

00:10:23: The other part of the research was Alzheimer's and Dementia.

00:10:26: For me when we were writing also And a very good friend of mine works with People who have Alzheimer's or dementia All this stories are researched.

00:10:36: We had a consultant for our actors.

00:10:39: We did workshop where talked about how people would have Alzheimer and dementia move, how they speak.

00:10:45: We had a whole day where we worked on this topic... ...and tried to also depict it in an realistic way.

00:10:51: Also this extreme oscillating between clearness.

00:10:54: They have very deep moment of clarity And then all of sudden the person can completely be somewhere else.

00:11:00: So that kind shifting between being here & not-here is very much part of disease.

00:11:07: also Rob,

00:11:08: what was working with your co-actor Ben Kingsley Adir?

00:11:11: It was like playing high-level tennis.

00:11:14: I wouldn't be surprised if i saw him play Arthur Ashe later on in the movie, you know what I mean?

00:11:18: He's very well paired and very passionate about his work And think that he'll see it on screen.

00:11:23: So yeah...it is like playing a high level tent hitting the ball back & forth.

00:11:26: The

00:11:26: story has also disliked the element of family That people are all cut off either from their families or they're struggling with these things that happened In the past.

00:11:37: How important were those for both of them to bring that element there?

00:11:41: How did each of you develop, like as a screenwriter and director with your character?

00:11:46: I think it's something very universal right that we're connected.

00:11:49: Of course if somebody commits crime or someone ends up incarcerated It has huge ripple effect on the whole family Their own families, their victims.

00:11:59: We really wanted to also show not just this one person affected but two families And friends.

00:12:05: The world is affected by crimes Somebody being incarcerated even if they were innocently incarcerated.

00:12:14: You know, whatever it's always a whole system of people around that.

00:12:17: so It was important in the script to honor dad and also take into account exact.

00:12:21: I just feel like you knows about for me as a performer taking on these good character?

00:12:25: You know you got to put all your personal prejudices aside.

00:12:28: No Even If he did kill somebody or Whatever The case may be They've Got him In there And play the Humanity You Know Played A human Being.

00:12:35: Because Whatever it Was That Got them in There Is Not the Complete Some Of Who They Are ultimately.

00:12:40: So I think for me playing this character, i get a chance to show people exactly that.

00:12:44: you know we are not the sums of our worst mistake and just like Petra just elaborated on it's trickle down effect from one situation or one circumstance can literally affect the whole group-people in family and friends and everything.

00:12:56: Just final question because we have to wrap it up at what would be your biggest hope for this film to achieve?

00:13:02: Or do no matter if its socially

00:13:09: relevant topic?

00:13:10: because of many reasons.

00:13:11: The prison population is aging, there's more and more old people especially in America with the three-strike law.

00:13:18: I think it's important to see the people in prison as human beings.

00:13:23: i don't think there's any point in dehumanizing them.

00:13:26: i think reflects badly on us as a society if we do that.

00:13:29: And i think its uh film also thinks about what makes us truly human like What Makes Us Connect?

00:13:35: I think it's a movie about compassion and tenderness, vulnerability.

00:13:42: And that is the kind of stories we need right now because... ...we live in world where all these things are pushed to the side.

00:13:49: We live at high point of toxic masculine worlds.

00:13:53: So this story is extremely relevant.

00:13:56: It will move people change their perspectives.

00:13:59: It'll be shown in prison, in San Quentin and I hope social workers can work with them and big life with people being touched by

00:14:26: it.

00:14:36: where stories like this can be embraced, all especially in the US.

00:14:40: Thank you so much for this

00:14:52: interview!