00:00:00: Hi guys, welcome back to Vision de Reel.

00:00:03: Today we are here with a couple of directors whose film you might already know because it had its premiere at Sundance where I could see for the first time and then went right on to Berlinale And now is in Switzerland at Vision De Reel.

00:00:19: It's Jari Peo!

00:00:27: It's usually important, it has so many vibrant characters and its about who ya cowboys.

00:00:34: Which is such an iconic theme!

00:00:35: So how did you find those people?

00:00:37: And How Did You Conceive the Idea of The Films?

00:00:40: I love that.

00:00:40: u say that Its funny because... It's an important thing.

00:00:45: A bit will laugh at that.

00:00:46: It started just like a friendship.

00:00:49: Rebecca & i have been friends for over ten years now.

00:00:52: Harito happens on Christmas Day and New Year's day.

00:00:55: So I invited Becca to come spend Christmas with my family.

00:00:58: we went to the Harry Bell.

00:01:00: Long story short, she was like do you wanna make a film about that Harry bell?

00:01:03: I'm just like yeah but... That's

00:01:06: our original story of our collaboration.

00:01:09: It really came from friendship and also like everyone else who worked on this film with us, I mean we came to filmmaking through the story And we were so lucky that our friends Who are so talented kind of volunteered themselves To you know took a chance on us as directors because they're like gay cowboys in Mishokan Like.

00:01:27: yeah it sounds great!

00:01:29: The film takes place during the time when Efraim grew up.

00:01:33: The characters, our participants in the film are also members of a pretty small community.

00:01:40: We really met both Noe and Joseph at the Jaripeos Really?

00:01:45: Or we met Noé on a bilay but...

00:01:47: Yeah it's similar thing just without bulls.

00:01:50: It was dance party.

00:01:51: A bunch of friends from Mexico City came to my hometown For birthday.

00:01:55: there is this big dance party And At the end of that we were getting tortas These sandwiches.

00:02:00: Noé approached us.

00:02:01: He said what you guys doing You know, just like so casual and we became really good friends almost immediately.

00:02:08: And by that time they were already pre-developing the film.

00:02:11: So I was like how would you like to be in this documentary with us?

00:02:14: It's like make me famous.

00:02:16: The

00:02:16: people who are in the film basically came to use.

00:02:19: you didn't even have to look for them.

00:02:21: Look

00:02:22: Joseph!

00:02:22: Joseph is sort of Glamourine Steve.

00:02:25: He was a bit harder to track down.

00:02:27: We saw him all the times at the rodeo because he can't miss it like fabulous.

00:02:33: and we were just, who is this diva?

00:02:35: We must talk to the diva.

00:02:36: It was a year-and-a half before we are actually able to film with him because he's so busy!

00:02:42: Because I mean it's what you see in the film.

00:02:44: He's kind of the mayor of the town...it's like..he's the president of The Church....He runs an annual town party, he's the choreographer for the folkloric ballet ,he's a makeup artist, he has a zumba instructor.

00:02:55: Like he occupies So much Of This Town With more us being but to fit into his schedule.

00:03:04: Was it hard to convince him be in the film?

00:03:07: He also wanted a star, It was hard find that time to film with him especially because when we went for the crew during winter holidays where he has most make-up jobs cause all of the weddings and kinsengeras happen around those days so hes just busy every single day.

00:03:26: But it wasn't until off season like May or something Rebecca and I went to town.

00:03:32: We started talking to him with the camera, he was just so casual about it you know?

00:03:37: He is very open to sharing his upbringing in like...the way that's been accepted into town.

00:03:44: since he was little So it wasn't really difficult for me to have him be a part of this film

00:03:50: You mentioned.

00:03:51: there are quite small towns or communities.

00:03:54: Is this kind of acceptance still an open culture Or would say these acceptances something It's special or rare, or unique to this place.

00:04:03: I think both... We focus the film in Benjamillo because that is what we can comfortably say about it happening there.

00:04:14: But Mexico such a vast diverse country That i know some more northern states are way more conservative but also southern states have like, you know.

00:04:26: Mushes in Oaxaca which are these kids assigned male at birth but then they're raised as a girl and it's the tradition that every family has a muche.

00:04:36: so there is just very diverse types of identity in Mexico.

00:04:40: In general I would say its much more accepting than what the rest of the world thinks.

00:04:46: There is also another talk on film about how some people speak about how their family knows or not.

00:04:51: so macro maybe knows but doesn't really just admit that they know about their queer life.

00:04:58: And was it, how much was there a point when making the film?

00:05:01: That is stand there in our way more out there and its' more open.

00:05:05: Was something people on the film did like or wasn't more something were anxious about?

00:05:11: We're really transparent with our participants all time and constantly sharing material and making sure whatever's been there are things felt okay.

00:05:20: being world.

00:05:21: I mean i should also say who we talk to, who were not interested in sharing their stories on screen.

00:05:29: Which is pretty normal right?

00:05:31: It's understandable almost any circumstance.

00:05:34: There's so many valences of sort, there's like closetedness and then their secretedness that sometimes is something a little more erotic.

00:05:43: And Then there are people Like Josephs who Are very out A lot Of things happening in an interesting sort of simultaneity I would say Because the dominant culture Is super traditional Very hyper masculine.

00:05:58: Our characters They belong In this community.

00:06:01: they're negotiating How they want to belong in it and how the can be most themselves there.

00:06:07: The

00:06:07: character of the cowboy, no matter if its queer or straight It's both iconic And also a cliche.

00:06:15: So wrapped in cultural ideological and social perceptions and ideas.

00:06:23: How did you unwrap all that stuff?

00:06:24: For

00:06:25: me was always like a vignette portrait Of my hometown.

00:06:29: These memories so queer subculture, subconscious.

00:06:35: I don't know.

00:06:35: from like a city perspective it's very easy to take come in point fingers.

00:06:40: Observing it through this lens of desire because its so hot and sexy, you know?

00:06:45: And that's how the slippery takes a part of it too.

00:06:48: You have the very thing with digital footage like the wide angle of very traditional matcha space.

00:06:54: Then the slippery works almost like a magnifying glass showing you the subtle detail stuff Like the caresses or looks just as coded language that happens between this match on them, how day it actually is.

00:07:09: Something I was really interested in with the performance of The Cowboy and its an arena for people looking at a man dominating a bull And giving like very specific almost archaic performance and masculinity.

00:07:25: But It's so clear.

00:07:27: you know from first time i went with Efrain to writer how quickly that performance was sort of disassembled.

00:07:36: You know, we got a lot of footage at the Harry Fales and when were writing the film When We Were Looking Back At All Of The Material And Started Putting It Together it became A Major Thread.

00:07:48: How Do We Start With Performance?

00:07:49: Undoing Throughout The Film?

00:07:51: And Undo In Terms Of Different Textures That We're Using in Terms of Abstract Sequences, in terms of the Super-Aid conversations with people.

00:08:00: These Moments are able to subvert the performance that you see

00:08:14: at the beginning.

00:08:29: I met them in me, you know?

00:08:31: They created this bond of trust.

00:08:33: So for four years every time we would go back and it was like... For me It was seeing the town in a different light And then next year is like seeing my family with a different line.

00:08:44: Then seeing myself With a different eye You notice just evolution Of mental state almost

00:08:51: The voiceover that We have In the film.

00:08:53: and This..You see That we constantly Go Back to the truck Where Efrain Is in the driver's seat behind the camera, all of that was constructed over four years.

00:09:02: We kept going back to that space and we kept kind of conducting more interviews than ended up being sort of this narrative thread.

00:09:09: This film is very much a process film like The Realization, I guess Emotional.

00:09:14: A frame having throughout the film in the truck took for us to do as well.

00:09:19: What would you say were your biggest challenges when shooting?

00:09:23: For

00:09:23: me it was accepting That i wasn't part of the film.

00:09:26: It's from the beginning.

00:09:30: Then it was difficult for me to portray myself vulnerable in this space and share my story.

00:09:36: But, It's something that the film wanted.

00:09:38: so there were a lot of listening.

00:09:40: what needed just letting go

00:09:42: When we began to realize that a frame-story is the centerpiece or narrative through line.

00:09:51: We also had to renegotiate our relationship as directors because both being behind camera into sort of turning the camera onto a frame in, and that took a lot of renegotiating or relationship building at different type of collaboration.

00:10:06: Building really deep sense of trust you wouldn't necessarily have when both directors are always behind the cameras so... That was like very long process.

00:10:15: I mean it wasn't an important process for us to help but It's tough!

00:10:27: Was it a conscious decision to say we want focus on this specific male gay cis community or was just that these other people were not there?

00:10:37: No, they are especially with the lesbian community.

00:10:41: We didn't put their story in as an afterthought.

00:10:45: Sometimes I feel like with documentaries People really wanted everything that could be said about a place or about the subject.

00:10:52: And we really want to tell a very narrow story, partly because trying to add in sort of like every sexual identity that exists in the play actually just superficializes their stories rather than you know.

00:11:05: what should happen is that us or someone else maybe go and make an entire other movie about their experience.

00:11:12: but they are very impressive.

00:11:13: They're like really good friends with Joseph.

00:11:16: Joseph's like the leader out there queer community You know, and like you can see them walking around with his posse in these girls' and the gays.

00:11:23: And even younger generations.

00:11:25: people say that The Queer Community has a before-and after Joseph because he was their first one to come out With the dress and nails and makeup.

00:11:36: Elder people in town saw him.

00:11:38: There's always a first shock when they see somebody.

00:11:41: After that it is oh another.

00:11:42: teenagers are just non-binary really comfortable in their flesh.

00:11:49: Despite this vibrant queer community that you described, still the majority is straight.

00:11:56: How did they perceive film?

00:11:57: Did you have interactions with them and how was the whole atmosphere when you made this film?

00:12:05: The film is very receptive of us as a film crew coming to film mostly because it's like a film about the Harry Bell or at least what we presented unsure on how comfortable our protagonists were with us sharing their story, just being discreet.

00:12:22: But now that the film is out and like the trailer's very clearly gay cowboy in Benjamillo... The town was so happy and proud to have Benjamillio On The Mouth And then having an international film be representative of our traditions and culture.

00:12:40: I think something we tried to communicate in this film.

00:12:43: You have sort of a very straight line from oppression to acceptance, or it's a very rural town.

00:12:53: It is very gender-based and traditional.

00:12:56: still There IS an acceptance but that doesn't mean those other things don't exist there And it's navigating everything existing in town at once, and everyone sort of wanting to have an idea belonging there.

00:13:09: And how do I look forward for that?

00:13:11: Now you've worked on this film quite a while.

00:13:14: How does it feel to present all these international festivals?

00:13:17: It's so heartwarming Just having people connect with the film In many different approaches Walk up after the film With tears in their eyes Like a thank-you Smile in the hug.

00:13:30: You know...it still makes me cry.

00:13:32: Joseph has has this very strong connection with the church and God.

00:13:37: I think that's one of them, most that hit me was just... This girl.

00:13:41: once she embraced her lesbianism She strived away from Church even though she grew up with it And loved God.

00:13:50: But now the Church doesn't love the gay.

00:13:52: So sad but fuck you god!

00:13:54: Once she saw Joseph being like God created me in his image her faith back.

00:14:03: And like she started crying because, like... She could now have a relationship with God again Because of Joseph.

00:14:10: It's just so beautiful to have these reactions.

00:14:15: We're not trying to speak about Mexico as a whole.

00:14:44: being complicated humans, and it's been really amazing to see sort of how people from like all around the world are able... There is something that touches them about this story.

00:14:54: Do you

00:14:55: have a new project?

00:14:55: if want share?

00:14:57: Just finishing there was a World Tour so far!

00:15:00: We

00:15:01: had couple things in development.

00:15:03: right now maybe some interesting thing could happen from Haripaeo as well.

00:15:08: we're still grasping what happened with Sundance And because we came to film making through this story as well, I think the reception's been amazing and a little overwhelming.

00:15:21: Yeah!

00:15:21: We've got ideas that were catching up with...we're catching it for the film.

00:15:26: Well

00:15:26: then..We are also gonna enjoy the film.

00:15:28: Haribo is now set with Yandereel & As soon as he gets released or local one than you'll read at it with us.

00:15:34: Thank You so much, Rebekah.

00:15:35: That's why i can't ever end Mojica.